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Comments
Representative for Economists For Bernie explains their platform
02/03/16, 14:38

This is what gets me about you and yours: you don't like the actual plan that might work (which is to take back Congress in much the way the Right took it over and it will likely be a long and difficult process), so instead you put all your faith in the guy who tells you to vote for him and not worry your pretty little head about the details. Well sooner or the later the details matter, and that's when it'll be clear you've been played. You probably won't be voting in midterms, though.

Democracy is messy because it involves lots of people with lots of opinions, and progressive governance is not some birthright of yours that has been stolen from you. You need to put good people in office (protest votes are a bitch move), you need to persuade your fellow citizens to join you, and you should have started in 2010.
Ouch! Watch This Comedian PERFECTLY Shut Down a Heckler!
02/03/16, 14:02

I would have sprayed him with 100% Wolf Urine.
Representative for Economists For Bernie explains their platform
02/03/16, 13:25

Roll out of bed and elect a Congress willing to enact these changes, hippie.
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/03/16, 08:28

Hey American Standard, I thought of you:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ye-XZ4Ukl08

You've got nice pipes sir or madam!
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/02/16, 22:13

Not in this case. Where is the similarity to "1984" exactly; where is John Cleese in any way deprived of liberty?
Bernie Sanders Iowa caucus speech
02/02/16, 21:54

"So he is calling for increased voter turnout to put more democrats (and presumably left leaning congresspeople in general) in office in order to break the obstructionist tactics used by the current Republican majority to cripple most of Obama's agenda, with active protest being an important but secondary measure. So what you said, but put in more simple, dramatic, TV friendly terms."

Funny thing is how infrequently he actually mentions Congress and leaves it for you (I mean you personally, OZ) to infer that's what he means. In that transcript he also talks about using the bully pulpit (which has never worked -- not even LBJ could get more than 8% of Southern Democrats to back the Civil Rights Act), he faults Obama for negotiating with Republicans as if there is an alternative when they have the power to obstruct, and if he means that his people have to vote in elections past 2016 I don't see him making mention of it. It would be incredibly easy for a person listening to Bernie to not hear an implied "Congress" all the time, almost as if a president armed with supporters and a bully pulpit and smarter brain than Obama is all you need.

It was nice of Bernie to mention Congressional Democrats once in a favorable light in that transcript though, because most of the time he draws little distinction between the Democrats and Republicans, for example here:

http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/18/politics/bernie-sanders/

Perhaps he feels some small obligation to not trash the Democrats 100% of the time now that he is running as one.
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/02/16, 21:20

I like Patton Oswalt's take on it: yeah there are people who go overboard, but that's the price we pay for having a society that is making an effort to pay attention to previously marginalized groups.

As far as I'm concerned, John Cleese's video is like living in "Newsbusted".
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/02/16, 21:13

I said "legitimately" for a reason. They may or may not find some way in which I have been insensitive to someone or other, but if they genuinely have, it will be a sign that society is getting better. It's possible that fairly routine turns of phrase that we take for granted will be better recognized as unacceptably derogatory in nature; it happened with "nigger", it happened with "faggot", I don't assume that it's done happening.

As for Cleese, let me put this in a way a dumb* lame** cunt*** such as yourself might understand. Voluntarily deciding to avoid (presumably paid) speaking engagements at universities because the kids don't like your material has no recognizable connection to a society where you're not allowed to speak your mind for fear of harsh reprisals by the government. That's not a matter of me being literal-minded, that's a matter of Cleese being a little bitch**** because he's not being greeted with the cheers he feels he is due.


*: slur against those who cannot speak
**: slur against those who cannot walk
***: slur against women by implying that womanhood is inherently inferior
****: slur against women by comparing them to dogs as well as implying that womanhood is inherently inferior
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/02/16, 20:25

Oh I get it -- Cleese is comparing university speaking engagements to "1984" without any similarities that would make it a valid comparison.

Even a smart guy like John Cleese says something bewilderingly stupid once in a while, and this is one of those times.
Bernie Sanders Iowa caucus speech
02/02/16, 18:59

Oh, so you can find where Bernie talks about the need to take back Congress, if you use a search engine to look for it. Well shit, with that sort of emphasis, I guess I misjudged him.

And did Bernie or did Bernie not speak of using a mob to overcome Congressional obstruction? He sure did. He may have said sensible things about necessary long term strategies, but he also said some crazy-ass shit about mobs too, and the message he ought to be sending should be less of the crazy, more of the stuff he buries on his site.

And again, this particular campaign speech, you are overly eager to excuse him for not speaking to the need to take back Congress.
Bernie Sanders Iowa caucus speech
02/02/16, 15:24

OZ - I shit you not. Here's Bernie's plan to overcome the Republicans:

---
What do we do? This is what you do. You say to the speaker of the House, "Hey, you don't want to negotiate with me? I think we should make public colleges and universities tuition free. And I think we should pay for a tax on Wall Street speculation."

Now, do I think the Republican speaker of the House will agree with me? No, I don't think so. But I think he'll have to look out the window and see a million young people demonstrating and marching in Washington saying, "You know what? We want to see affordability in college."
---

http://www.nbcnews.com/meet-the-press/meet-press-transcript-october-11-2015-n442476

That's Bernie's plan: mobs that will frighten the Republicans. The only good thing about that plan is how unlikely it is that Bernie will be able to amass a million droogs.

I don't need to tell you how it would sound if Trump suggested a similar plan.

Anaxagoras - I guess what makes me mad is that the solution has been available for years, but nobody wants to do it: vote in every election, even the midterms (ESPECIALLY the midterms), to knock the Republicans out of power. If you want to improve the Democrats, you can do that in primary season.

The Left, instead, has been sitting out the midterms, getting mad that Democrats couldn't do more with ever-dwindling numbers, and have constructed elaborate mythology to justify an "a pox on both their houses" perspective. That's exactly the worst way to go about this. As I like to point out, the public option failed only because there were not enough Democrats in the Senate, not because the Democrats didn't give it their full support; the only sane, un-fucktarded response would have been to vote hard in 2010 to elect more Senators, but the Left sat it out.

Let's say someone you love desperately needs to lose weight; we know the answer there is diet and exercise, plus a visit to the doctor to look for any underlying causes. Except your beloved ham beast refuses to do any of the hard work, because doctors are all quacks, and there's this health guru from Vermont who says that the snake oil he's peddling will make you slim (in combination with buying his video lecture series). That's about how I view Bernie Sanders.
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/02/16, 15:08

Speaking of O'Brien, John Dolan suggests there is subtext to "1984" that may be lost on us Americans, such as how, in Orwell's nightmarish world, an Irishman has power over an Englishman.
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/02/16, 15:05

I look forward to the time when 20-year-olds can look at behavior I find perfectly acceptable and they can legitimately identify some way I'm causing harm. Here's hoping I'm decent enough to mend my ways.
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/02/16, 15:01

That guy - John Cleese is the person saying that "college students not liking his material" equals "totalitarian world where all human liberties are eliminated in service to the state". We know he's saying this because he's using a service that allows him to say virtually anything he wants to every location with an Internet connection and it doesn't cost him a dime.

Yep, I can totally hear those jack boots a-tromping.
Bernie Sanders Iowa caucus speech
02/02/16, 12:18

I don't doubt he's mentioned Congress sometimes. But I don't see any mention of it on his campaign Web site, I've heard him plan to overcome Congressional obstruction by summoning hordes of followers to march in the street, and Bernie does a piss poor job of differentiating between Republicans and Democrats, each of whom may take corporate money, but even if Bernie's right that they're all "bought" they're still very very different. So Bernie's messaging on Congress is mixed at best, and I think woefully inadequate for someone who promises so big.

The proof is in the puddingheads: talk to some Bernie supporters, a huge number of them seem to think that electing Bernie just takes care of everything, because he will use the "bully pulpit" to force Congress to do what he wants and single payer is on its way!
John Cleese: Political Correctness Will Lead to a '1984' Society
02/02/16, 11:12

"Come on, Bort. You're smarter than that."

YOU TAKE THAT BACK.

So college students don't like Cleese's material because they are, in his eyes, too "politically correct". Being unfavorably received by university students is less consequential than ever, at least as far as guest speakers like John Cleese go. He can get his message out just fine if he so chooses; this video is proof. There's no censorship going on.

I am lumping Cleese in with hacks, not because he is necessarily a hack, but it sounds like he shares the hack's habit of blaming the audience rather than considering whether his material could be improved or reconsidered. Views that were pretty acceptable 40 years ago may not be so today, and that's something to keep in mind when talking to young audiences.

And yes, to be sure, college campuses are one of the few places where political correctness can get out of hand. If it truly is a case of John Cleese speaking unpleasant truths that college students are too sheeply to hear, then it is unfortunate for all parties. At this point we have only Cleese's word that he had critical (but fair) commentary that the masses weren't willing to tolerate.
Bernie Sanders Iowa caucus speech
02/02/16, 10:09

"the moneyed interests that have taken over Congress"

Excuse me, "the moneyed interests that have taken over WASHINGTON". No mention at all of Congress.
Bernie Sanders Iowa caucus speech
02/02/16, 09:57

OZ - you're right, I haven't been watching Bernie's videos. So I just watched the end of this video, the last part where he's making the appeal of all of us working together. Can you point me to where he mentions Congress? This is his argument: that if we all work together with Bernie, we can overcome the moneyed interests that have taken over Congress, without any mention at all of the need to take back Congress. ("Well he implies" NO HE DOESN'T.)

Now I say this even louder than ever: fuck you Bernie Sanders for misleading your supporters. Fuck you for building a cult of personality when you should be telling your supporters to vote without fail to oust Republicans. Fuck you for building up the expectations of your supporters so that they will be disappointed in a year's time whether or not you are in the Oval Office. Fuck you for not being honest about how this actually works. Fuck you for being the demagogue and not the leader.
Bernie Sanders Iowa caucus speech
02/02/16, 08:26

I'd like someone to explain what Bernie is actually supposed to accomplish.
Bernie Sanders Iowa caucus speech
02/02/16, 07:38

We have never had a Congress capable of passing single payer, and right now Congress is arguably more opposed to it than it has ever been. Sanders might as well tell you that, if you elect him, you'll be able to fly by flapping your arms. (Still aren't airborne? You must be flapping wrong.)

The plan, such as it is, always remains the same: vote for the best Democrat in the primaries, but more importantly, vote Republicans out of office in the general elections. Once Democrats are there in enough numbers, change is possible.

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