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Desc:A woman tried to make a documentary about sexism in videogames. Gamers responded with rape threats.
Category:Video Games, Crime
Tags:nerds, Gamers, rape, misogyny, you are a terrible person
Submitted:WHO WANTS DESSERT
Date:11/07/12
Views:2228
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Comment count is 75
John Holmes Motherfucker
SUCCESSFUL TROLL IS SUCCESSFUL!

The youtube comments are pretty rich. "Everybody gets rape threats" is the worst defense of rape threats ever, and it doesn't really make sense to say "it's just words, man up":, and then attain levels of butthurt approaching religious frenzy when someone criticizes your gaming culture.
kingofthenothing
Oh yeah. I mean on the one hand this video does seem like some Lifetime: Men Are the Devil Channel b.s., and on the other, it ignores a lot of other kinds of harassment that go on, like all the times people get called faggot niggers and/or jews, or jew nigger faggot cocksucking motherfuckers. This video makes women come off as more emotionally fragile, or at least tries to make the case that women need protection more than men when it comes to harassment online. Maybe they get harassed more per capita, but there weren't really any numbers given out here.

I also have to wonder what companies had the "beer before noon" and "porn is OK by US" policies. Those must have been some real shitholes. I only ever had one job where I could drink on the job and that was in food service.

Is anybody wondering if these "games designed for women" are going to be really sucky and flop if and when they ever get released? I just looked up the Silicon Sisters thing on Google and yeah, it looks like a real snooze fest. What, girls don't want to play a game where you can blow shit up? I find that hard to believe.

Old_Zircon
I can't speak for beer and porn, but I used to know someone who worked for a big league ad firm in San Francisco and they official had pot brownie Fridays most weeks.

Gojira1000
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/6264-Anit a-Sarkeesian-The-Monster-Gamers-Created

Riskbreaker
This shit again?
endlesschris
"Rape threats" sure is a scarier sounding term than "stupid rape jokes made by idiot internet kids."
Hooker
Yeah. I had written most of a response about how, while I hate that it goes on at all, I think it's dishonest to equate 4chan abuse with actual death threats.

John Holmes Motherfucker
A threat doesn't have to be credible to be "an actual threat". The idea behind threatening a woman you'll never see with rape is to remind her of her vulnerability, the weakness that keeps most women off the streets late at night. It's humiliating. Men who would never dream of committing real violence are not above evoking that sense of vulnerability in a woman who doesn't know her place.

Cherry Pop Culture
Oh wow, John, you hit the nail on the head.

I have had experience with weird dudes in broad daylight with people around on my college campus. It's something that permeates in our culture.

Old_Zircon
I thin you mean "the effect of" not "the idea of."


The latter implies that the people that do it are doing so with a deliberate agenda (or at least some degree of self awareness). Which by and large the don't.

Misogyny and rape culture are a real, major problem, but I'm confident that they aren't any kind of deliberate conspiracy outside of groups like TFL and PUA and the far right fringe and stuff. It's more about ignorance, fear, and unfocused anger than anything deliberate.

Hooker
Women are not the only people to get death threats online. Online misogyny is awful, just as offline misogyny is. I'm talking about the news calling a "die die die" Facebook post a death threat.

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>I'm talking about the news calling a "die die die" Facebook post a death threat.

There are only two things about such a post that qualify it as a death threat: 1) The words used, and 2) what those words mean. What part of "die die die" do you not understand?

Most death threats are not credible, but if a joke is supposed to be funny, die die die works better as a threat than as a joke.

Caminante Nocturno
Nobody who speaks German could be an evil man.

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>I thin you mean "the effect of" not "the idea of."

>>The latter implies that the people that do it are doing so with a deliberate agenda (or at least some degree of self awareness). Which by and large the don't.

>>Misogyny and rape culture are a real, major problem, but I'm confident that they aren't any kind of deliberate conspiracy outside of groups like TFL and PUA and the far right fringe and stuff. It's more about ignorance, fear, and unfocused anger than anything deliberate.


The "agenda" is to intimidate and humiliate. It doesn't require a conspiracy, or any self-awareness. It's just old-fashioned bullying.

endlesschris
Looking at her flickr image, she's used that research money to buy a variety of games which there is no point in researching critically. Not to mention the sheer volume here. What is she going to do, play five minutes of each? http://www.flickr.com/photos/anitasarkeesian/7619451560/

I see Viva Pinata / Banjo Kazooie in there. Can't wait to hear about the importance of feminine characterization in those.
Caminante Nocturno
You'd think feminists would be upset with a woman trying to make a financial gain out of her victim complex.
WHO WANTS DESSERT
Shut up, pedophile.

Caminante Nocturno
Oh, no!

My feelings!

Quick, everyone, give me money!

CJH
let's be fair, adult women are pretty frightening

BHWW
Caminante probably has gone out on dates with women...

and they probably went...a little something...like this:


http://www.whompcomic.com/comics/2012-10-12-Save-the-Date.jpg

Spaceman Africa
at least Ronnie is endearing

Caminante Nocturno
I have become the victim of online bullying.

Now I truly understand a woman's pain.

Fezren
I joined a CS server one time that was very obviously hosted by a group of neo-nazi skinheads. So I quit and joined a different server.
StanleyPain
That analogy is awful and doesn't work at all in this case.

Caminante Nocturno
It would if we all started giving Fezren free money in an attempt to spite the offending server.

Fezren
It wasn't an analogy.

memedumpster
All gamers are terrible, even girl gamers.
FABIO
Was this the woman who spent thousands in kickstarter money buying dozens of games to "study" for sexism? Something she could have done for free with youtube Let's Play videos?

What is this whole effort supposed to show? That games have you rescue the princess? That people are horrible online and will latch onto anything to viciously mock?

Taking that money and setting up a scholarship for one girl to get a comp sci degree would have been more productive.
Cherry Pop Culture
Nonsense CJH, only the ones who have been screwed over by their exes.

Riskbreaker
She showed the world what a strong willed independant woman she is, she did that by asking for money to a bunch of strangers. Also, she hasn't even made the video.

Vaidency
She showed the world that gamer culture is full of angry, reactionary misogynists.

There are already about five comments here in this section accusing her of being greedy or duplicitous, exaggerating the problem and having a victim complex. And as she notes in the video itself she hasn't even published any results of the study yet. All of this furious backlash is in response to just the IDEA of a woman investigating sexism in gamer culture.

Seriously, she just proposed a crowdfunded sociology study and the response she got included a video game where you can beat the shit out of her. And the general consensus of gamers seems to be that she is at fault.

Riskbreaker
The mysoginist comments are terrible, nobody is going to question that, but, have you seen her videos? She has no clue of what she's talking about, not to mention that if she was really interested in this project she would have done it for free. She doesn't need to buy Banjo fucking Kazooie and other pointless recent games for that.

sosage
It's a medium that can't be critiqued from just visual/audio alone. So I definitely don't see the problem with buying a ton of games and pushing through them for the sake of research. As ridiculous as POETV finds video games, it is barely half-assed to write about an interactive experience by just watching videos. No other medium would tolerate that sort of short cut, why should this one?

What always made this project questionable to me has more to do with who she is and why does she need funding? Her video's topic has been ongoing for longer than most think, discussed by game journalists (HAH!) and a variety of professionals. What does she bring to the table that others have not? Is her point of view and ability to critique so much more radical and forward thinking that it deserves funding (even when she was just asking for 3-6K)? What separates her from the many passionate people who discuss these issues for free? Would she even bother doing this pre-KS?

Those questions (although really one question asked many different ways), though, are now moot thanks to the half-wits that turned her into a massive Internet abuse target.

Portaxx
Yeah what exactly is the problem here? Are people here denying that there is sexist content in games? And if you admit there is sexist content in games, is everyone here honestly saying that's not worth looking into?

Vaidency is right. She hasn't even made the video yet. The outrage was in response to her PROPOSING THE IDEA of researching this stuff. Why would anyone be angered by such a study?

Vaidency
Risk, I agree that it's entirely possible that her methodology is flawed. But, as Sosage pointed out that's not even the story anymore. If her proposal had been met with valid criticism of her approach, or simply disinterest in funding the study, nobody would be talking about her at all anymore. She ended up inadvertently stumbling into a much larger and more explosive story, and one that should definitely be discussed.

(I also agree that anyone writing about games, whether studying them or reviewing them or whatever, should actually be playing them, not watching other people play them on Youtube. It was entirely appropriate of her to actually try and acquire the games and play them herself as research in the study. I've never played Banjo Kazooie so I have no idea whether or not it might be relevant. Maybe she just wanted it as a control or a sample from a particularly genre or console. Who knows?)

John Holmes Motherfucker
If you've ever been the test subject of a psychology grad student's study (in my college, it was necessary to get credit for Psych 101), you learn very quickly that, if they bother to explain the study to you while they're testing you, they're lying. I would be very much surprised if she's going to queer her sample by publically revealing what she's up to in videos.

It's just folly to criticize the methodology of a study that hasn't been published yet. To criticize comments in youtube from men who expect women to respond to rape threats as they would? Personally, I'm okay with that.

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>She showed the world that gamer culture is full of angry, reactionary misogynists.

It's true. Some people seem to think that her research methods are flawed, so threats of violence are justified.

FABIO
Is there some new bitch-slap-rape-o-matic feedback controller that I don't know about that makes it necessary to actually buy and play a game to find out it's sexist - an element that comes across entirely in non-interactive story and dialog scenes - rather than just watching a longplay on youtube?

Is it sexist to point out that the whole thing comes across as a pointless masturbatory money sink exercise at best? If the problem is not enough women making games, then use that cash to put some through school. That's probably better than making buttons of Peach wearing overalls telling boys to stay home.

I always thought stuff like Bioware game romance writing was more grating and offensive that cartoon women in revealing outfits, and those are probably one of the biggest instances of "by women, for women" in the industry.


(What the heck is sexist about the Gears of War chick in her logo? or...whatever that floating pinata thing is)

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>Is it sexist to point out that the whole thing comes across as a pointless masturbatory money sink exercise at best?

Unless the study has been published and you've read it, it's pretty fucking stupid.

Caminante Nocturno
She has made other videos, and if this was is (was?) going to be anything like those, then it would have been short on substance and heavy on pompous ego stroking. She's just trying to put an intellectual gloss on her sanctimonious, shallow complaints. It's incredibly annoying that people expect that sort of thing to be taken seriously.

However, that's no longer the issue, because the huge overreaction she got overshadowed all of that and allowed her to act the victim. If there is a serious issue here, none of the parties involved are capable of addressing it properly.

Also, she got far more money out of this than could possibly be necessary or deserving due to spite donations, which is funny and sad.

FABIO
Ah, bunch of comments popped up before I finished that.

The story is definitely the reaction. If no one had said anything this would have just been another dumb inept kickstarter endeavor. All her visual examples are either the very worst the medium has to offer or completely ridiculous (Are kidnapping victims a forbidden subject? Ashley was magnitudes less sexist than Maggie Grace in Taken. How is the Gears of Wars woman dressed exactly like the men sexist? Lara Croft is about as sexist as hulking no neck space marines. Etc.). It'd be like using the covers of Conan novels as a statement on how sexist books are, and now you need to buy out an entire Barnes and Noble store to prove it.

Trying to convince people that you need thousands of dollars to tell the story of how the witch zombie in Left 4 Dead is a damaging portrayal of women or how Skate 3 reinforces gender stereotypes (http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7274/7619451560_2371b4cffb_z.jpg) is ludicrous. Even if it turns out to be some blind psych study the whole thing was just to show that people on the internet are horrible.

duh

sosage
Critiques formed by cutting out the most crucial expression of the medium are invalid. Interactivity and rules is video game's unique expression, as pacing and timing is film's. You can't discuss film by having only watched a trailer or only reading the script or watching random clips with no context.

Can you form an opinion on sexism in video games just watching clips off Youtube. I guess, but you might as well swap "video games" for "popular culture". You're missing the key element that makes a video game a video game...and a case can be made that sexism through interactivity and rules in the medium exists.

FABIO
Every game has youtube videos of the complete playthrough from start to finish, so it's more like watching the entire film.

Unless you're saying you can't realize that Cortana is wearing a ridiculous outfit unless you're physically pushing a button to make Master Chief shoot at aliens.

That's totally nuts, but even if it were true then it would make this whole VIDEO project entirely pointless since no one could ever experience sexism in game unless they were actually holding a controller while the Dead or Alive chick's boobs jiggle.

THAT IS HOW SILLY YOU'RE SOUNDING RIGHT NOW

sosage
If I sound silly, it's because I made the mistake of having an involved discussion on the site I use to post stupid videos and write snarky comments on.

I can't keep re-explaining how video games are different from other mediums and why you need to play them to critique them. It's one of those things where you either understand that point or you don't. No hard feelings though!

FABIO
"You cannot get a proper sense of sexism in games from just watching a video, so she's right in spending thousands to buy and play these games so people can watch a video about sexism in games."

That is silly.

Please name one single instance of sexism in videogames where it cannot be entirely understood from watching a video as opposed to actually playing it. Do you need ,000 to answer that first?

sosage
I don't need to give you one...I'll just give you the running cliche of the entire medium instead: any game that makes the female playable characters contain what is considered "feminine" rule sets and traits. Such as making them considerably less able than their male counterparts. Make certain interactive situations a burden or hassle in very specific ways because you chose the female instead of the male.

This design scenario is a norm and is definitely open to being analyzed and critiqued on if the designer is making a statement...and what that statement is.

FABIO
Seriously what the fuck is that floating pinata thing.
John Holmes Motherfucker
>>The story is definitely the reaction. If no one had said anything this would have just been another dumb inept kickstarter endeavor.


So why do YOU keep coming back to the nonstory? As of now there is no story, nothing much to criticize, and yet you can't let it go. And yes, the story is definitely the reaction.
FABIO
JHM on not letting it go!

Because both stories are retarded. The original was outrage over some cartoon women in revealing outfits. Now the new story is someone getting the same treatment anyone taking a controversial stance on the internet receives and turning ego stroking into a martyr complex.

They could have altered it to cover how EVERYONE is treated like this online, how the problem is internet anonymity and solving it would involve changing the entire way that works, but they chose to stick to coming at it from the angle that it happened to a GIRL who plays GAMES and now we need to gather more women programmers to make more GIRL GAMES because the real cause of toxic attitudes is not enough Sims knockoffs.

So yeah, the new story is also retarded.

John Holmes Motherfucker
FABIO on not getting it.

John Holmes Motherfucker
This is our emerging culture, and how we are to interact with each other in the future.

FABIO
Is this your thing now? Endlessly defending idiots featured in videos here? You're doing it in the "Hitler did good things" video for christ sake.

This woman is an inept self-absorbed money grabber. 4chan is awful. There it's settled.

John Holmes Motherfucker
Inevitably, here's some Boxxy for you.

In July 0f 2011, Catie Wayne (Boxxy's real name) blew everybody's mind on her site when she posted a cartoon she had found somewhere, probably /b/.

In the cartoon, Boxxy is shot in the face, and her corpse is raped in the empty eye socket. I'm not kidding. Take a look (NSFW):

http://tinyurl.com/af2g9eb

Around the same time, people were actually showing up on her doorstep. I don't know how it affected her, but I would have been terrified.

This is our tough guy internet culture. It's ugly, brutal, hateful, stupid, and conformist, and these fucks are absolutely correct in assuming that they don't want it examined.
Riskbreaker
I agree with several points made by many of you here, but once more, her "research" is flawed, her opinions shallow and overall, this is a glorified ego stroking project. The entire thing boils down to "HEY GUYZ, HERE'S A PICTURE OF A VIDEO GAME FEMALE CHARACTER IN REVEALING CLOTHES. THIS MEANS VGS HAVE LOTS OF SEXIST THINGS, WHY? WHO KNOWS!" Now that the internet drama became the story, what was suppose to be the main subject is now sadly lost. Video games are still stuck in a sort of puberty identity crisis phase, but nobody from the industry, from the, ahem, "vg press" or the fans are making any real journalistic research.
EvilHomer
H ow is that a "sexist" reaction? Within gaming culture, rape threats are applied equally, without regards to gender. Rape is simply something you do, whether it's to a man, to a woman, to a little kid, or to a fag who needs to stfu. Violent reaction? Maybe. But it's totally inclusive and tolerant in respect to gender and sexual alignment.

The only way one can possibly conclude that gaming culture is "misogynist" on the basis of rape threats, is through the imposition of irrelevant, outside community standards. Primitive, 20th century community standards, white middle class cultural constructs which claim that the rape experience is unique to women, and can never be justified regardless of how much the n00b sux.

That sort of blatant social imperialism would make her a fascist, and we can rape fascists, surely.
Cherry Pop Culture
I am more likely to be raped than you simply because I am a woman. That's why rape threats, no matter how stupid or dumb, frighten many women. And when we complain, we were asking for it or making it up.

John Holmes Motherfucker
H ow is that a "sexist" reaction? Within gaming culture, rape threats are applied equally, without regards to gender. Rape is simply something you do, whether it's to a man, to a woman, to a little kid, or to a fag who needs to stfu. Violent reaction? Maybe. But it's totally inclusive and tolerant in respect to gender and sexual alignment.


Yeah, and laws requiring photo ID to vote apply equally to blacks and whites.

"Everybody gets rape threats" does not make rape threats a good thing. Nobody fucking cares

What's sexist about this attitude is that it implies that the more typically male response is the "correct" response. Believe me, it's sexist as hell to tell a woman to "man up".

And again, this whole discussion is a reaction to criticism. Overall, I'm getting the message that rape threats are okay, criticizing gaming is not. It looks to me like gamers are the ones who need to man up.

Zanac
the worst

Zanac
you are the worst

EvilHomer
Cherry Pop, more likely to be raped? Or more likely to be "raped"?

Let's not forget what we're talking about here: pissed off gamers, and pissed off gamer couture. According to the statistics I just pulled out of my ass, 95% of the victims of gamer rape are male. This roughly corresponds to the ratio of male gamers present in a high-rape environment (ex CoD, Starcraft) to females. And for fucks sake, they're GAMERS. All joking aside, anyone who hears a man named SniperPwnsJoo97 say he's going to rape you, then makes the leap to "oh no, my orifices are in literal danger", is dumber than they are.

Once again, this is a nonissue that could easily be avoided through the simple act of NOT applying paranoid, 1960s white person constructs to a culture which is, evidently, completely alien to you.

And Mr Holmes, who says that having a sensible attitude towards gamer rape threats is a "typically male" response? I certainly don't. It's rather sexist of you to try and gender the responses, yes, but that's on you, not on gaming culture.

John Holmes Motherfucker
Jesus, you are a flamboyantly stupid motherfucker.

This has been done to death, but to humiliate and to intimidate does not necessarily involve the orifices.

>>NOT applying paranoid, 1960s white person constructs to a culture which is, evidently, completely alien to you.

Yes, it was back in the 1970s that rape threats became a good thing.

>>Cherry Pop more likely to be raped? Or more likely to be "raped"?

You're questioning that a woman is more likely to be LEGITIMATELY raped than a man? Only in the real world.

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>That sort of blatant social imperialism would make her a fascist, and we can rape fascists, surely.

Nope.

FABIO
Men are much more likely to be violently murdered. Should they start a shitstorm fundraising campaign the next time someone gets a "death threat" playing Call of Duty?

A 1960s mom trapped in a young woman's body perfectly sums this up. It started out as an inept attempt to raise unnecessary funds to study a non-problem and has turned into the most retarded martyr complex.

Sanest Man Alive
While we're talking about crowdfunding, I just wanna go ahead and point out that Penny Arcade's kickstarter project to become "ad-free" (because buhhhhhhhh), in blatant defiance of the very principle of Kickstarter, has garnered over 0k already:
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/575109064/pe nny-arcade-sells-out

And just so everyone stops getting their shorts in a twist, here's a an already successfully crowdfunded documentary on how guys in games are really just as much victims of discrimination as girls, honest!
http://www.indiegogo.com/misandryinv ideogames

Fair's fair, right?
John Holmes Motherfucker
"Addendum #1:

This project does not constitute an attack on Anita Sarkeesian, nor should it be seen as a response to her work! Anita has done an amazing job, and it's really incredible to see so many people stand up for more diverse video games.

While our campaign may tread upon similar lines, we have no intention of encroaching upon Feminist Frequency's work, and urge you all whole-heartedly to head on over to http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/566429325/tropes-vs-women-in-v ideo-games to find out more. To Anita and her supporters we'd like to extend our warmest congratulations for smashing targets in such fantastic style, and we can't wait to see her upcoming work!"

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>She has made other videos, and if this was is (was?) going to be anything like those, then it would have been short on substance and heavy on pompous ego stroking. She's just trying to put an intellectual gloss on her sanctimonious, shallow complaints. It's incredibly annoying that people expect that sort of thing to be taken seriously.

There was a time, BEFORE the reaction, when this wasn't a painfully clueless statement, but that's all over now. Before, people weren't expecting anyone to take her work seriously, they were expecting her not to be threatened. Now that's all changed, because attacking someone is the ultimate form of taking them seriously.

And if her study states that these guys are idiots, well, she's not going to need that much of an intellectual gloss.
urworstnightmare
bla,bla,bla.... blargh ... so if you are in this shit and you have 2 options: be wise or go play with dolls
John Holmes Motherfucker
Some of you need to step back and realize that you're DEFENDING RAPE THREATS.

I know I'm being ethnocentric, but I'm choosing to proceed from the bias of my native culture, which I shall call "Planet Earth", where threats of violence, whether implied or explicit, credible or not credible, serious or "joking" is never considered an appropriate way for strangers to communicate. Threatening someone with violence who is not themselves a threat is a major social taboo where I'm from. Again, I am talking about Earth.

I mean, some of you geniuses are actually defending rape threats, and you seem to think that I need to "understand gaming culture" in order to have a valid opinion of that. I've had similar encounters with Guy Fawktards who think I need to "understand anonymous culture" in order to have an opinion about hunting down and threatening underage children. To all of you, I ask: Have you ever been to Planet Earth?
WHO WANTS DESSERT
Forget it John, it's Gamertown

John Holmes Motherfucker
Nobody wants to live in a world where you can't threaten people over the internet. I'd rather live in a world where making a violent threat is a loser move that destroys your credibility and enhances the credibility of the target.

Happily, that's still the world we live in, and that's what happened. From the point of view of THE WORLD, which is still the big game, there's no question that Anita Sarkeesianom won this argument. She outsmarted these geniuses without doing a damn thing. GAME OVER.

urworstnightmare
we understand what you mean JHM
the violence begins at own game itself ... it really disgusts me to see how many women are victimizing themselves with issues like those, it's only trash talking and you must know it will happen when you are in such environment

the world of online games is as dangerous as letting your child surf the internet without any kind of parent control, unfortunatelly the Earth is full of fawktards anywhere and there will always be people who will get benefit from this hideous situation such as that Anita ...

so it's like I said before if you have some gray matter hide your SPI and have fun but if you can't handle this situation abandon the ship ... it's a gamertown well said and good reminder from WWD

FABIO
Nobody is defending rape threats you dense shrill. Or death threats or violent threats. You're as desperate for this to be a real problem as she is.

The trash talk guy at a pick up bastketball game is an asshole, but you don't deal with it by asking the town for money so you can make a IT SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BE THIS WAY public service announcement. You find a different group to play with.

The fact that they're focusing on how this is exclusively a gender issue and how it deserves special pedestal consideration when the target is a woman is more sexist and condescending than any amount of cartoon skimpy outfits.

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>Nobody is defending rape threats you dense shrill.

In retrospect, I think "excusing" them would be a more accurate word.

>>You're as desperate for this to be a real problem as she is.

I believe that rape threats are a bad thing, and I find that I don't have to cling to that belief all that desperately.

>>The trash talk guy at a pick up bastketball game is an asshole, but you don't deal with it by asking the town for money so you can make a IT SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BE THIS WAY public service announcement. You find a different group to play with.

Apparently this is an analogy for something.

If it's kickstarter, I think it's a pretty bad analogy, since kickstarter solicits voluntary donations, and a town gets money through compulsory property taxes. I think people have the right to ask kickstarter for money for any fool thing they want. More power to them if they can get it. No skin off my nose.

I have no opinion on this kickstarter program, or this woman's work, or gaming culture. I think video games are pretty boring, actually.


>>The fact that they're focusing on how this is exclusively a gender issue and how it deserves special pedestal consideration when the target is a woman is more sexist and condescending than any amount of cartoon skimpy outfits.

Actually, I think cartoon skimpy outfits are awesome.

Rape threats are absolutely a gender issue. Are they EXCLUSIVELY a gender issue? Can't imagine why that matters. Probably not, I guess.

Maru
Five for John Holmes meltdown.
BorrowedSolution
I hope you all get raped.
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