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Category:Horror, Crime
Tags:feminism, misogyny, thunderf00t, what feminists actually believe
Submitted:fluffy
Date:12/14/14
Views:1508
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Comment count is 50
joelkazoo
He should of stuck with making fun of creationists.

5 for evil.
The Great Hippo
The thing is, if you watch his old creationist mockery videos, you can kind of see that this is the sort of person he is: A loud, obnoxious school-yard bully.

Potholer can be obnoxious and sneer-y, but when somebody starts making threats in his name, he stops and addresses it. And if you admit that you made a mistake, he's not going to continue beating you up for it. Yeah, I don't always appreciate his mockery, but at least he's playing by a set of rules that make it clear he's not here to ruin your day. He clearly loves science, and his insults are his way of dealing with how people out there are abusing something he loves to reaffirm their ignorant beliefs.

But this guy? There's no love of science here. There's just this smoldering hatred for anyone who *dares* to question the validity of his beliefs. He's not into science because he loves science; he's into science because it's easy to defend, and easy to define the people who abuse it as idiots -- which, in turn, props up his sense of self worth. Science is how he props up his sense of self worth.

And regrettably, it's these types of ass-clowns that make science so tricky -- because they'll defend their stupid, out-dated scientific theories to the death regardless of all the evidence that mounts against them. Because they're not in it because they love knowledge; they're in it because they hate being *wrong*.

Basically what I'm saying is that it is *totally* okay for me to hate this guy and like that potholer guy.

oddeye
Not only will my bro Potholer leave someone that admits defeat or retracts their statements alone but he will also happily, GLADLY in fact, admit that HE is wrong and doesn't know or have answers for everything. Potholer welcomes people to present him with valid evidence that runs counter to anything presented in his videos.

If I had my way he would be appointed as like.. Universal President of Pushing Science Into Your Brain or something and everyone would have to study his series of videos on how the universe was formed etc.

Old_Zircon
I just can't bring myself to give this guy any more views.
EvilHomer
Not going to star this until I hear from JHMF.
The Great Hippo
What's weird about this video is that, taken out of context, a lot of the stuff he's saying is actually pretty reasonable: Western culture *does*, in fact, dehumanize men -- it *does*, in fact, reaffirm the notion that men are disposeable, interchangeable objects that can be sent off to die in wars without batting an eye. Male suffering is trivial and scorn-worthy; something to be relentlessly mocked and belittled rather than addressed. The notion that men suffer domestic abuse is so repellant to us that to even note its existence is usually taken as an attack on *women* suffering from domestic abuse.

However, the irony inherent in the video's title -- that when he starts talking like a feminist, some of the things he says actually turn out to be relatively reasonable (aside from the whole 'women-killing-men' trope) -- is likely lost upon him.

This is the inherent problem with the majority of male-affirming anti-feminist rhetoric: It forgets the 'male-affirming' part and just goes straight for anti-feminism. I'd get along with MRAs if they could just stop bitching about the feminists and concentrate on addressing and supporting male rape victims -- or dealing with some of the bizarrely destructive alimony and custody laws -- or, fuck, even start having some real conversations about male-targeted domestic abuse.

But no, no, none of that; we can't have a discussion about issues that affect men -- we need to talk about all the evil feminists who are responsible for destroying our culture!

I actually don't like feminism as a movement. It's got a bad history of negating, belitting, and ignoring women of color, transgender women, and -- well, any woman who isn't white, middle-to-upper class, cisgender, and pro-choice. But whatever beef I've got with feminism, I've at least got enough sense to understand that feminists have *nothing* to do with how, if I'm raped, I'm expected to suck it up and never talk about it again. Or how it's cowardly of me to not want to go shoot people and die for my country. Or the legal quagmire I need to navigate if I want to leave an abusive (emotionally *or* physically) wife and keep the kids.

But this guy, he sure as fuck doesn't. To him, it's as simple as this: Feminists are whiners, men need to suck it up, and any problems we actually face as a society are because women won't stop bitching about how our happy-fun-time murder simulators grossly represent them as objects to obtain, control, or rescue.

Fuck this guy and fuck his repellent nonsense. He has all the intellectual capacity of a lobotomized shrew.
FABIO
Part of the problem is that you really CAN'T have those "male affirming" conversations without being accused of all sorts of horrible things, woman-hating being among the most common. The worst I've seen is tumblr posts calling male prison rape a good thing because otherwise men wouldn't understand the plight of women.

The Great Hippo
Yeah -- I've talked to feminists who have told me, straight-faced, that *every* woman should be thankful to feminism.

I'm down with large swathes of third-wave feminism; I think feminists can throw a pretty bitchin' party. But feminism is not immune to criticism, and is not equipped to handle every issue regarding gender. I've met feminists with more self-entitlement and hot air than a joint PUA-MRA committee hosted on a blimp made of solid gold.

Gallez
No one would have a problem with MRAs if they actually gave a shit about things like male rape victims or male domestic abuse survivors, but if there's anyone who actually does it's probably feminists.

takewithfood
For you, Hippo

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>What's weird about this video is that, taken out of context, a lot of the stuff he's saying is actually pretty reasonable: Western culture *does*, in fact, dehumanize men -- it *does*, in fact, reaffirm the notion that men are disposeable, interchangeable objects that can be sent off to die in wars without batting an eye. Male suffering is trivial and scorn-worthy; something to be relentlessly mocked and belittled rather than addressed. The notion that men suffer domestic abuse is so repellant to us that to even note its existence is usually taken as an attack on *women* suffering from domestic abuse.

Whatever discrimination and unreasonable expectations men are subjected to is caused by sexism. MRAs want to blame feminism, which is either stupid or dishonest. There are women who hate men, and guess what? Many of these women are drawn to feminism. But this really has nothing to do with the forces subjecting men to discrimination and unreasonable expectation. Like video games, feminism is not above criticism, but it is the only thing that has had success against sexism.

http://youtu.be/Ed__AIKtsHE

Here's a video I made about Thunderf00t's claim that Anita Sarkeesian had personally gotten him thrown off Twitter. When i submitted it in October it never made it out of the hopper, but it's a pretty good illustration of his shitty logic. I suppose he's a smart guy, but smart guys, even scientists, can come to some pretty stupid conclusions. See William Shockley.

Note: Did not watch the video.

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>Yeah -- I've talked to feminists who have told me, straight-faced, that *every* woman should be thankful to feminism.

I think this is true, but nevertheless, my stars go to Hippo, and not to Thundert00l.

I hear talk of "toxic masculinity", and I believe there is such a thing, but is there a "toxic femininity"? I believe there is, and I'd feel better if we could acknowledge that, but again, I believe that such a thing exists.

Here are a few things that I've come to believe about gender politics.

1. The time has come to discard 'oppression' as the negative model in gender politics. Oppression happens, but what's going on now can generally be referred to as "dysfunction".

2.There are individuals who act badly, but there is no one gender that is to blame.

3. Men really do need to listen to women much better, but judging men as a gender is the worst possible way to be heard.

4. and vice versa

5. We don't come out of the womb understanding ourselves, much less those who are brought up of the opposite gender. "Not getting it" isn't necessarily stupidity or aggression.

6. I consider myself to be a feminist... but as a man, I don't always see gender issues the same way a woman does. There's nothing inherently wrong with that. Men and women are not necessarily supposed to agree all the time.

John Holmes Motherfucker
>>Part of the problem is that you really CAN'T have those "male affirming" conversations without being accused of all sorts of horrible things, woman-hating being among the most common. The worst I've seen is tumblr posts calling male prison rape a good thing because otherwise men wouldn't understand the plight of women.

I wouldn't go that far, but if reading those hateful tumblr posts teaches you something about the plight of women, I think that would be great.

Believe it; womenon the internet are exposed to hate speech like that constantly, often in a much more personal form. Feminists can be obnoxious as hell, sometimes because of the current charged environment, and sometimes just because they hate men. I'm not defending that. Sexism against males is indefensible and counterproductive, and so is racism against whites. But when it happens to me, I've had to overcome my hurt feelings, and remind myself that other people have been subjected to this indignity all along. I'm not so special

dairyqueenlatifah
I don't see how he's wrong....
The Great Hippo
He's not, beyond the women-killing-men trope (which is really just a gross oversimplification). Popular media is such a mess of stupid gender essentialist nonsense that you can spend years picking apart all the terrible ways in which we portray women *and* men.

The Great Hippo
Like, take everything he's saying and remove references to 'feminism' and 'women' and suddenly it's a long-winded screed about the disposeability of men in movies and video-games.

Which totally is a thing. Men *are* disposeable entities in movies and video-games. And while you can argue that this doesn't contribute to a society where men are treated as disposeable entities, it's at least, in some way, *reflective* of that culture.

Cena_mark
His argument falls flat considering all these disposable men exist in a world where the main heroes and villains are also men. Its not men who are disposable just, henchmen, ninjas,and Al Leong.

EvilHomer
So the talent agent just stands there, looking kinda shocked. And he looks up at The Great Hippo, and he says "Wow, kid. That was... that was some act. Whadda ya call it?"


*chaaa* "IDENTITY POLITICS!"

FABIO
There are movies where the main character and villain are women, but I don't think I've ever seen a movie where women make up the disposable element.

Hentai doesn't count.

The Great Hippo
Slasher movies, maybe -- but that actually plays on the fact that we *don't* see women as disposeable. Horror movies are about breaching taboos, and part of the narrative of countless slasher movies involves the 'tragic death' of numerous attractive women -- oh and some guys died too, maybe? Who remembers?

The Great Hippo
(Though actually I think a lot of modern film-makers have realized this to some degree and play with it -- 'Dog Soldiers' comes to mind, as does 'Descent' -- both slasher films which play with these ideas, though your mileage may vary regarding how well they do so)

MacGyver Style Bomb
When is this bullshit going to end? 2014 has fucking sucked.
FABIO
Cheer up. We're 3 weeks away from flying cars and hover boards!

infinite zest
In a way I enjoy it. I don't know if it's the most pointless debate I've ever been alive to witness, but it's up there. As far as I know the death and rape threats have stopped, which is never cool, so now we're all along for whatever the fuck this is about. Ironically it's more fun to watch than playing a video game.

Nominal
This guy has the starting point for a good thesis but regularly pisses it away with neener neener mocking tones.

But the solution isn't to spam the front page with even stronger negative neener neener tones. Good god, the Westboro Baptist Church doesn't get half as much hate here.
The Great Hippo
Nobody takes the Westboro Baptist Church seriously except the Westboro Baptist Church. People actually listen to this guy. They take what he's saying seriously. His arguments demand what little attention it takes to refute them.

But I get it, I really do: It's way easier to stick your nose up in the air and proclaim yourself above all this nonsense than to actually give a crap about the things people are saying.

asian hick
,What makes you think that you and the Gamergate creeps are entitled to a civil response? You love to cast yourself as some voice of reason, but you're doing the same shit you accuse the other side of doing: ad hominem attacks on people implying they're "white knights" because they want sex, willfully distorting the message of the other side and so on.

The only difference is that you're outnumbered here and crying for people to stop while you dribble shit wherever you go. Why would someone want to dignify your bullshit with a serious response?

infinite zest
I think he needs to rewatch Kill Bill. Those weren't all men. Then she goes and kills the woman she was trying to kill. It's a valid point. Even with Looney Tunes, you'd never see a female character get hit with an anvil, and I inherently always felt like kind of a jerk for having to kill the female enemies in a game like Golden Axe, whether I was playing as the dwarf or the chick (the sword guy wasn't very good.) But that's not really Anita's point, or at least I don't think it was, that the world of games would be equal when we could all beat each other up, and women could rape men. I can't believe this is still going on.
Bort
By now, whatever Anita's original point was -- whether she was right on the money or Suey-Park-grade ludicrous -- the reaction to Anita is the real phenomenon to pay attention to.

Spaceman Africa
This dude has a small head for his huge neck.
oddeye
He really does. He's like a Cardassian from Star Trek or something with that thing.

oddeye
ALL people should just be treated equally, given the same rights, the same protections, equal earnings for equal work, religious freedom (including freedom from religion), etc.

Rape is a terrible crime regardless of the genders of anyone involved and it shouldn't happen to anyone, anywhere, EVER. Gender blindness should extend for every other crime or social trespass there is.

If you don't agree with the sentiment of the absolute truth that I have simply reiterated here then I SINCERELY hope that you are fucking destroyed. Inside I'd love for you to be put down like a cow that has gone mad, not far from the truth but I would settle for the complete removal of your entire existence, completely erased from space and time.

Just POP and you, with your poisonous mind, your rancid filth that you have for a "moral compass", your whole diseased being are just gone, as if you never existed.

So just fucking treat each other well and we need not live in hell. (I just made that up, pretty good right?)
The Great Hippo
...instead of wishing that anyone who disagrees be destroyed, can't you wish that they change their mind, instead? I mean, that seems like a better (and more likely) thing to wish for.


EvilHomer
Hey oddeye, sort of on-topic: what's it like living in a country where female orgasms are now illegal?

EvilHomer
Also, I hope you're not into breath-play 4 realsies, because I hear David Cameron is going to put all you people down "like cows that've gone mad", and I'd be sad to see you die. :(

EvilHomer
Well, actually no, scratch that. The UK loves mad cows, they're your national animal! He's going to put you down like a, I dunno, like a Paki teenager loitering outside Tescos, is rather what I should say.

The Great Hippo
EvilHomer, you are some sort of creeptastic creep-engine.

EvilHomer
Not me!

http://www.salon.com/2014/12/02/uk_bans_spanking_and_female_ej aculation_in_porn/

(somewhat NSFW)

The Great Hippo
Yeah, no, I'm fully aware of that news story. I'm just pointing out that you are creepy as all fuck and I hope to God you don't treat people like this in meatspace.

EvilHomer
Honestly, though, they won't kill oddeye just for being a sex-pervert who *isn't* also a millionaire connected to the Crown and the BBC. They'll probably just give him an arbitrary ASBO and then stick surveillance cameras inside his council flat so that the government can monitor his behavior 24 hours a day. THEN, if the telescreen catches him doing something super naughty, like owning a knife or copying music from a CD he owns onto his computer, at that point they will kill him.

EvilHomer
Like wot? I said I *didn't* want him to die! Didn't!

He doesn't deserve to be destroyed, which is the same as you feel, I reckon.

The Great Hippo
'Hey, internet person, let me demonstrate that I know what country you live in and talk about female orgasms and how your Prime Minister is going to kill you for your sexual proclivities'

'haha I'm just joking -- seriously though he's going to put you down'

'naw though here are some other circumstances under which you will be killed wink wink just kidding ;) ;) ;) ;)'

People like you are one of the reasons why so many of us avoid posting things on the internet. It's actually a little scary just how oblivious you are to your own creepiness.

Unless you're doing this shit on purpose, in which case -- fuck you.

EvilHomer
Oddeye has been very forthcoming about his country-of-origin, as well as his proclivities. He's also totes serious about everything he says.

EvilHomer
I'm sorry, Oddeye. I realize now that I have been very insensitive towards your feelings.

The Great Hippo
I don't care what oddeye has been forthcoming about. Unless you two have some sort of 'rapport' which I am not privy to, the things you are saying and the way you are saying them is not acceptable in *any* sort of company -- polite or otherwise.

I am bringing this up because you do this a lot. Your posts are creepy as fuck. You don't seem to take the time to consider the context or impact of what you are saying.

Yes, having an uninvited discussion with an internet stranger about their homeland, female orgasms, their sexual proclivities, and the circumstances under which they will be executed is *very* creepy. I don't care that you're just joking. Unless you've got some sort of pre-established relationship with oddeye where you know this sort of thing will be taken the right way, it's fucked up, and it's even more fucked up that I have to post here to *tell* you that it's fucked up.

Hell, maybe oddeye's fine with it. They seem thick-skinned, I don't know. That's not my point. My point is that *you* are fine with saying shit like that to people you don't even know.

And here's the thing to take away from this: This sort of deranged, self-oblivious creepiness? It's *everywhere*. Now try imagining navigating that sort of landscape if you're especially vulnerable -- if you've been a victim of abuse, emotional or physical.

Yeah, I'm freaking the fuck out over a really tiny post, but that's just because I've had to comfort and help too many people in genuine fear for their lives -- because they were vulnerable and someone said something that was so extraordinarily creepy that it set off those vulnerabilities. I'm sick of this oblivious bullshit, and I wish more people would stop and actually take some time to think about the things they say and do.

If it's any consolation, I wouldn't take the time to type this much at you if I didn't think there was a chance it would have some sort of impact. I'm not going to bother explaining to a complete moron why they're a complete moron; I'm only going to bother with people who seem like they might genuinely be capable of changing.

EvilHomer
Actually, I think Mr Oddeye and I DO have a rapport. We've e-known each other for quite some time; we mess around now and then, he and I have discussed Britain at length (I am a bitter ex-pat, he is a proud Brit-supremacist), we've shared a mutual interest in the psychology of trolling, and, while breath-play is not really one of my "things", I've went out of my way to help him track down material before (one of my hobbies is tracking down and cataloging weird internet fetishes; that one can be hard to find, thanks in part to it's borderline illegality). I did this when *he asked* for such help, and when nobody else even bothered to lift a finger to help the poor fellow.

On the other hoof, I don't know if *you and I* have enough rapport yet for you to fly off the handle and devote eight whole paragraphs to calling me a creep! Particularly right after I apologized to my friend!!! Do *you* treat people like this in meatspace?! :0


But it's OK. I forgive you, and I apologize if this was triggering for you.

The Great Hippo
If that's the case, and you genuinely know oddeye, then I apologize.

That being said, you're still an incredibly condescending and incredibly creepy person.

EvilHomer
>> That being said, you're still an incredibly condescending and incredibly creepy person.

Well, in that case I'd just like to refer you to what my good friend The Great Hippo said above; I think he sums up my reply to you better than I could.

John Holmes Motherfucker
Sorry, i'm just going to post this here on the bottom, where it can be seen.

>>Yeah -- I've talked to feminists who have told me, straight-faced, that *every* woman should be thankful to feminism.

I think this is true, but nevertheless, my stars go to Hippo, and not to Thundert00l.

I hear talk of "toxic masculinity", and I believe there is such a thing, but is there a "toxic femininity"? I believe there is, and I'd feel better if we could acknowledge that, but again, I believe that such a thing exists.

Here are a few things that I've come to believe about gender politics.

1. The time has come to discard 'oppression' as the negative model in gender politics. Oppression happens, but what's going on now can generally be referred to as "dysfunction".

2.There are individuals who act badly, but there is no one gender that is to blame.

3. Men really do need to listen to women much better, but judging men as a gender is the worst possible way to be heard.

4. and vice versa

5. We don't come out of the womb understanding ourselves, much less those who are brought up of the opposite gender. "Not getting it" isn't necessarily stupidity or aggression.

6. I consider myself to be a feminist... but as a man, I don't always see gender issues the same way a woman does. There's nothing inherently wrong with that. Men and women are not necessarily supposed to agree all the time.

7. Thunder00t is a huckster, who treats his adoring fans like children.
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