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Desc:Another good day for science.
Category:Science & Technology, Educational
Tags:Einstein, gravitational waves, LIGO
Submitted:Pillager
Date:02/12/16
Views:1387
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Comment count is 41
fedex - 2016-02-12
Now lets get down and surf those waves! Hang Ten baby!
chumbucket - 2016-02-12
Q: WWJD?
A: *
baleen - 2016-02-12
to offset one of the shittiest people on this website.
Chocolate Jesus - 2016-02-12
these gravity waves are a fucking bore and you know it

lotsmoreorcs - 2016-02-12
pipe down boy

Rodents of Unusual Size - 2016-02-12
What did those gravity waves do to you!

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-12
I'd like to believe ChocoJ is making a nice pun on solitons, rather than just being ...a bore.

That guy - 2016-02-12
Yes. That must be what he's doing.

Chocolate Jesus - 2016-02-12
you're all so bitchy today

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-13
...not just any old bore, mind you. A tidal bore.

jimmyboblahey - 2016-02-12
#IFuckingLoveScience
lotsmoreorcs - 2016-02-12
STOP FUCKING WITH BLACK HOLE STUFF

DID NO ONE READ HYPERION
Old_Zircon - 2016-02-12
RACIST

lotsmoreorcs - 2016-02-12
i may be a racist but ChocolateJesus still doesn't know who his father is OZrk

Gmork - 2016-02-13
Hyperion has nothing to do with black holes. The shrike is going around pinning everyone to the Tree of Pain, and seven schmucks have their own semi-interesting stories.

Endymion, on the other hand... now THAT's how you take a boring universe you just constructed and give it meaning.

Chocolate Jesus - 2016-02-13
hey my father lives in a million dollar lakeside home KEEP DREAMING

gmol - 2016-02-12
[Venn diagram about people posting about gravity waves vs. people who understand gravity waves]
Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-12
You know, Gmol, what struck me about this work? The telescope works by virtue of the delay between the receiving stations. Their presumed wave speed for gravitomagnetic radiation is C. If the station can connect it's recorded events with corresponding physical observation, you've got a pretty good case for claiming experimental proof that the speed is C.

That has some profound consequences. For example, try calculating orbitals and whatnot where gravity is delayed rather than being instantaneous ( as is assumed in the newtonian mechanics ). Just try it.

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
Counterpoint: Mr Wildcat believes we can reach the stars by holding on to giant birds.

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-12
Counter-counter point : Any hope of a large scale escape of this gravity well is gonna require an engineering grasp of gravitomagnetism. We just took that first step. That bird's plenty big enough to ride, homestar.

Old_Zircon - 2016-02-12
Birds birds birds!

This is the most disgusting display of dragon erasure I've seen in years.

memedumpster - 2016-02-12
Gravity waves are not gravitational waves. Those are two separate terms for two separate phenomenon.

You need to let an adult draw that diagram.

http://astroengine.com/2009/01/20/gravitational-waves-and-grav ity-waves-whats-the-difference/

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-12
Come to think of it, the proof will come when a large number of events are collected and plotted. If the speed really is the assumed C, the events ought to be distributed isotropically in space. If the speed is higher, the field of view of the scope will narrow such that events won't be found ahead of or behind the axis connecting the stations.

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-12
Someone just posted me a link to the paper.

https://journals.aps.org/prl/pdf/10.1103/PhysRevLett.116.06110 2

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
"is gonna require an engineering grasp of gravitomagnetism"

Right. You get some engineers with a background in applied science (not theoretical scientists) to demonstrate that they can make use of these things - under proper testing conditions, mind you, none of this "gravitational-wave-cars magically hopping over speed bumps, because oh wait, the course was rigged" nonsense - and then, Michio Wildkaku, then maybe I'll be impressed.

memedumpster - 2016-02-12
*gently slides EvilHomer over the far side of the diagram*

Oscar, keep talking... I'm close (saying for a friend).

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-12
Uhm, that is what is under discussion. This is the first engineering application. There is nothing theoretical about those detectors.

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
I am on neither side of the diagram, my dear Mr Dumspter, as I am not an expert on gravitational waves, nor do I like posting about them. If I am to be placed anywhere, then I am either to the top or to the bottom, outside the boundaries of both of gmol's sets.

Show me what the gravitational-wave bird can do for us, and if (like Bose's electromagnetic suspension system) it can do nothing as of yet, then at least give me a convincing argument as to why I should retweet this.

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
>> Uhm, that is what is under discussion. This is the first engineering application. There is nothing theoretical about those detectors.


Wait, sorry, were gravitational waves used in building LIGO? According to the video and the paper you linked, LIGO uses a laser interferometer, which would make this an engineering application of *lasers*, not of gravitational waves.

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-12
To quote Wolfgang Pauli:

That's not right, Homer. That's not even wrong.

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
A device which can detect the existence of gravitomagnetism is not the same as having an "engineering grasp of" gravitomagnetism, any more than a telescope which can view the sun grants you an "engineering grasp" of nuclear fusion.

Yes, using a pair of laser interferometers to (allegedly, according to these researchers) detect evidence of the existence of gravitational waves is an engineering application, and yes, it is a "first step" (arguably a second step, given that these waves have been theorized to exist for almost a century now) in maybe possibly finding a technological use for gravitational waves - whether that is to "escape this gravity well", as you put it, or to do something else. But it is not, in and of itself, an engineering application *of* these waves.

memedumpster - 2016-02-12
Nah, you're covered, Homies. Every good scientific chart has a column for noise.

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
I think the bigger problem here, something which gmol alluded to and something which came up in that now-thoroughly debunked Bose video yesterday night, is this tendency for people to dive headfirst into the buzz over every little advance (real or imagined) that takes place in SCIENCE. People (and I include myself in this!) have a tendency to overinflate the significance of scientific stories which are presented to them in a romantic, dramatic fashion, even when they themselves don't have a professional-level understanding of (or stake in) these stories, even to the point of shutting down their ability to think skeptically...!


I'm not trying to be confrontational. While I don't see why we should give this story anything more than a "meh, that's nice", I am totally open to new points of view here. If there *are* no real-world engineering applications for gravitational waves at present, then that need not be the deathknell for gravitational-wave social media buzz.

Messrs Wildcat and Dumpster, what do YOU find compelling about this story?

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
Meme - yeah, I can accept that! I'm happy to be noise in this diagram, until you can convince me otherwise.

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
Also, something I've been wondering: have the papers been thoroughly peer-reviewed yet, and if so, did they meet approval? Also, how many times have these waves allegedly been observed? Are there multiple, independent sources who can corroborate this team's observations, and if not, how long will it be until we can see independent confirmation (or refutation) of their findings?

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-12
Read my first reply, Homer.

In addition, we now have experimental evidence that suggests the speed of gravitomagnetic radiation is c. If that doesn't give you a boner, you need some viagra.

EvilHomer - 2016-02-12
Yes I read it, and no it doesn't, but then again these days the only thing which can give me a boner is watching ponies get eaten by plants.

gmol - 2016-02-13
EH, that was a good summary of my intent.

Oscar Wildcat - 2016-02-13
So now it's the both of you fapping to MLP vore? Good thing our ancestors didn't think this way, we'd all still be living in caves ( cue grainy footage of neanderthal EvilHomer drawing PinkyPie on the cave walls at Lascaux )

godot - 2016-02-12
This is also the first discovery of black holes of greater than 25 M⊙, and they found 3 in a fraction of a second.
That guy - 2016-02-14
RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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